Sizing bullets

[Nuclearcricket]

Been thinking about some things over the holiday, I have time on my hands, but I have come up with an idea or 2 but wanted to toss out a question for you all before I get into any of the details.
I know and understand that the preferred thing to do is to shoot bullets as cast, however that isn't always possible as some molds will throw a bullet just a bit too big, ie. a .411 bullet to go through a .408 barrel. What I was wondering is this, if any of you have used the Lee push through sizer, does it leave a raised edge on the base of the bullet and do you feel that the raised edge effects anything adversely?
Thanks in advance.
Sam

[Gunlaker]

I have a few push through sizers and although I seldom use them anymore, with the exception of one, I've never found them to deform the bullet base in any way.

I used to use the Lee dies but switched to the Meacham ones as you can get all sorts of inserts for them. I never got the lubing feature to work all that well on that model, but maybe my lube was too stiff.

The only one I use right now is a Fred Cornell .445" die which I use to size down .446" bullets prior to patching.

Chris.

[Don McDowell]

I have never noticed a raised edge on the bullet when using the Lee sizers. The stem that pushes the bullet thru is an extremely close fit to the die body, so there's really no place to fin the base.
The big question on those lee size dies is will they really be the size they are said to be...

[Kurt]

Sam.

I have sized bullets down. three thousands is more then I personally would go. It just displaces to much in the direction your pushing the bullet through. I pushed some .514" .50 cal gov bullets through a .510" Lee die and the base punch had to much slop and I ended up with base fins where the base punch pushed. Maybe a harder alloyed bullet would not deform the base this much? I don't know. You cant compress lead, you just displace it. There is just to much slop between the base punch and die body on some of them.
If I want to change a cast bullet's diameter or ogive I will use the swage press.
My 52 S&W takes a .355 diameter full wad cutter and I used the Star Lube seizer to reduce the .358 wad cutters and that worked out just fine because they had a slight bevel on both ends.

Kurt

[Nuclearcricket]

Thank you gentlemen for your reply's. Kurt that seems like a very tight barrel on your 52, almost makes me wonder if it started life out as a 9mm and then chambered in 38 spl. But anyway, I did not know that the Lee punches fit that tight. What got me thinking about all of this was the statement on Accurate molds about using a flat punch in your luber sizer to size your bullets as it would allot the bullets to self center. It made sense when I read it and then I got to thinking and looking at some bullets that I have sized with a close fitting top punch. Where I have seen the most problem is with my 9mm bullets, the truncated nose profile, along with a 400 gr 40 cal mold. They both have a tight fitting top punch and both show marks that they are not centered in the sizing die. In my mind that can not be a good thing as it would cause the bullet to start its way down the barrel off center and is a problem that will not self correct. When I first noticed this in the 40 I thought that maybe I had gotten the sizer die a little crocked when I laped it out and really didn't give it much thought but the rifle never did shoot as well as it should. I think I now know why, off center bullet = bad accuracy. With the 9mm and other flat tipped pistol bullets, its a simple solution to make a flat top punch to correct that little problem. With the other bullets its a different story as they are round nose. My thoughts were to make up an adapter to fit in the press that will hold a standard sizer die and then just push the bullets through after they are lubed, or perhaps before. After they are lubed would make the process a little easier and prevent galling.
Now it seems like I maybe need to rethink the push rod thing a little. It shouldn't be too hard to make rods .001 or so under the sizer diameter. The thing I don't want to do is to have to turn the rods down from stock large enough to fit into a press ram. If I make them to only fit into the shell clamp on a Co-Ax press it shouldn't be that much of a deal to do.
Any thoughts on this project idea?
Sam

[Kurt]

Sam.

I don't know why the 52 had a tight barrel. But it was common with the 52 and 52-2 Masters what the other competitors said theirs was too.
When I first got the 52 I was shooting the .358 wad cutters hollow and flat base in it and I could never get the accuracy out of it till I found out to use a .355-6 in it and everything came together.
I have a couple Lee push through dies in .45 and .50 and every one the punch will fall out freely even with lube on the die walls. They will wiggle they are so loose in the die.
For the .38 hand guns I use a Star lube seizer I use a flat punch pushing the nose through first It squares the bullet in fine shape before it gets tight in the die.

[Lumpy Grits]

My 52's bbl is almost as tight.
You got to remember, that the 52's were built to fire flush-nosed wadcutters only. My load was 3.0gn Bullseye with a 148gn w/c.
Gary

[bruce moulds]

sam,
if your 411 bullets will fit in a fired case, you might be wasting your time sizing them to 408.
this is because there is a high probability that they bump up
to whatever size the internal obturated case measures when you light the fire and before they move.
you are really doing work for nothing.
smokeless is a different deal.
all that sizing down and sizing back up cannot be beneficial to accuracy.
a lot of people prefer to fill the case with alloy for best results. if this requires a bigger bullet, then the chamber is too big, or the brass too thin.
keep safe,
bruce.

[Kurt]

Well that is a good point.

[bruce moulds]

kurt,
an interesting exercise is to set your vernier on 0.003". (0.408 to 0.411)
divide that by 2 equals 0.0015 equals how much the bullet moves.
this can make a difference to gas leakage if too small, but if too big ensures a better gas seal and therefore a better more consistent start to the bullet.
it is hard to see without glasses.
keep safe,
bruce.